I recently caught up with Wende Zomnir, the visionary co-founder and Chief Creative Officer of Urban Decay. We chatted about her start in beauty, the industry in the ’90s, technology, and why having a real-time connection to the sales floor is crucial. As a hands-on leader at the Urban Decay Mothership (headquarters) in Newport Beach, CA, she continues to disrupt the beauty landscape and is the guardian of the “beauty with an edge” brand DNA.

When did you know that you wanted to have a career in the beauty industry, or was it opportunistic?

I think it was a little bit of both. I’ve always been very passionate about makeup. My favorite gift was a blockbuster set from the first iteration of Calvin Klein cosmetics. I remember taping up pictures of supermodels on my bathroom mirror and trying to recreate those looks. All the practice resulted in getting me sent home for wearing too much makeup in the 8th grade.

I was always very into beauty, makeup, experimenting and trying new things, so it was natural that I wanted to do something in the beauty industry. I started my career in advertising and working for big agencies, but I knew pretty quickly that I wasn’t interested in a traditional corporate career. That’s when I knew I wanted to do something entrepreneurial coupled with my love of beauty, which really led me down the path to launch Urban Decay.

While you were in college you worked at an Elizabeth Arden counter. What did you learn from that experience? What was it like?

Well, I learned that there are good customers at the counter and not-so-good customers at the counter. I worked with a lot of older ladies who had long, long careers behind the counter, I was like their granddaughter. I would watch these women interact with their long-term customers and it was amazing. They’d have a new launch or something come up and they’d get out a card file and start calling people—I mean it was old school but they had relationships. They could say “I got six new lipsticks in” and create a little mini event at their counter within two days. They’d have people lined up.

I watched the way they interacted with their customer—it made me realize how important a personal connection is in the beauty industry, whether you’re working with vendors to create new products, like I do now, or working at the counter with customers. We’re talking about products that you put on your face to express yourself and to make you feel more confident. It’s a very personal and artistic thing. So it requires a personal and passionate relationship in order to move the business forward.

It seems like you’ve translated your early experience at Elizabeth Arden through the connection you have with the Urban Decay consumers on social media.

Now we have this direct connection to the customer through social media, which is very interesting but it doesn’t replace the connection with each counter person and receiving their feedback. That’s really important.

Before social media we really relied on the teams in the store. For example, I would call Kim Bowers [current AVP of Ulta Field] at the beginning and say, tell me what people in Chicago are saying about the new product. What are the people on the floor telling you? What shades do they like? What’s selling in your store?

It’s why we have people like Steve Kassajikian and Amanda Rodriguez [Global MUA] who started with the brand on the retail floor working at the Urban Decay Headquarters now on social media. Their deep roots with the brand and relationships with our field team allow them to get us real-time information from the retail floor.

It’s so important to me to have a path for our retail salespeople to communicate their knowledge. Not all of them want to come work in HQ and not everyone wants to sit behind a desk, but it’s important to create a path for those people into the Mothership because they really are your bridge to your field and ultimately the consumer.

How would you describe the Urban Decay culture?

Even though we are owned by L’Oréal, I think we still have an entrepreneurial culture. To work here at the Mothership you have to be someone who knows how to get things done. You need to be willing to roll up your sleeves, get down in the trenches, and do whatever it takes to get the job done, I don’t care what the title is on your paystub. Our culture is about a tight team that pulls together, who are passionate about makeup, and who give it their all every day. I think it’s a very fulfilling place to work. If you drink the Kool-Aid.

What advice would you give someone in the field that wants to work for HQ/ Mothership?

One of the most important things that you can do is to make yourself known. That is what both Steve and Amanda did, they made themselves known to me. I was at an event in NY when Amanda was our field salesperson on the floor and she rocked it out. She made conversation with me, made sure I knew who she was, asked me for a photo, and then she followed up. She made herself known to me and she proved herself to be a rock star at her job.

Sometimes there is the perception that brands have a “type” they’re looking for when hiring. Is there anything specific that you look for in candidates for Urban Decay?

The thing with Urban Decay is that we want it to be beauty with an edge for everyone. However, you do want to express yourself. Our inclusivity comes from the fact that we don’t have any defined stereotype or notions about what beauty is. And that’s been the brand mantra from day one.

I’m a really good salesperson for about an hour and 45 minutes, and then I have no energy left. People who can take that exchange of energy with the customers and allow that to feed them rather than to deplete them is something that I look for in candidates. I mean, it’s a world of big personalities, right? But I also think that there are roles for such a wide variety of people on the Urban Decay field team because sometimes people want to work with someone who is a little more low-key. Our goal is to have a wide spectrum of people on our team because there’s a wide spectrum of Urban Decay customers.

What is the best piece of career advice you’ve ever received?

I would say it’s one I discovered. Always remember that you get into this business for the passion—because you’re passionate about beauty and for makeup and for artistry, but it’s also important to remember that it is a business. You have to treat it that way. You have to come at it like a businessperson a lot of days and not just like an artist. What I tell people it that it’s fun to make money. You want to generate dollars because it allows you to do so many other things with your brand, with your counter, with your events and everything else.

From your perspective, how is the industry different today from when you launched the Urban Decay brand?

The world is completely different beauty-wise than it was back in the mid-90s. In the mid-90s there were only counters. There was no Sephora, there was no Ulta, there was no Macy’s Impulse, there was no Nordstrom free shop—it was all counters. We got our start at Nordstrom’s on what was basically an end-cap. We had a little shelf where two counters met, and that’s where we placed a display. The world is really different now, because then, brands like ours didn’t really stand a chance. We didn’t have salespeople at the time, we were really small. The staff at the store was incentivized to sell the brand they represented, so it was a tough world for us.

Things really changed when Sephora arrived on the scene and shook up the beauty world. They were able to do that because there were a lot of small brands like Urban who needed a home where they could be loved. That was really when the beauty industry started to change.

How has the role of beauty advisors changed?

It’s a really different world for the beauty advisors because they’re looked upon more as artists now than ever before. You still have to have great selling skills because that means you know how to help a customer. It’s not about pushing things down her throat, it’s about identifying her needs and helping her.

The artistry piece is more important than it’s ever been because people have access to tutorials on YouTube that talk about different techniques and they want to learn to master them. Sure, some people can learn to do it from a video, but others want or need a little help. For example, a customer may want to do a color-correcting technique even though they can’t believe putting red or green on their faces is going to be a good thing. They see how good it looks in the video and an artist in-store has the technical skill level to take the customer through the process, making it specific to them.

I think it’s cool that the people working on the floor at retail are viewed as experts today, not as someone who’s just pushing the latest, greatest, thing. I would imagine this must be really fulfilling and exciting for someone who’s starting a career at a retail level.

Is there anything that you miss from the beauty industry of the ’90s?

No. no. How about this? I missed that brown lipstick and I brought it back and called it 1993.

How do you feel technology and beauty tech is changing the industry?

I think technology and beauty tech is going to continue to evolve. I find it amazing that sometimes we get a strategy kind of set underway and we immediately have to change direction. I think there is going to be even more and more technology and it’s going to happen faster, you just have to be ready to adapt because you don’t know what’s going to be coming at you next.

I think the virtual try-on is going to get better and better. If you look at what it looked like five years ago compared to what it looks like now, it’s already light years different, and in five years it’s going to be exponentially better. I think they’re going to perfect the ability to shade-match your skin on a mobile device, which will push more consumers to shop online. It’s already turning in that direction.

As a beauty industry we have to be really aware of that and think about what the experience will be at the store level. I think people will still want to shop in a store, but it’s going to be less functional shopping and more about getting a service. As brands, we’re going to have to adjust at the retail level. I think it’s going to be different but more exciting than ever before because it’s going to be more about entertainment and experiences.

What trends do you predict for 2018 or beyond?

First, I’m excited about the gloss trend that’s coming because I love wearing gloss—it’s really comfortable. We’re going to see more textured choices and new innovative textures in gloss. Second, I’m also excited to see the glitter trend continue and evolve. Finally, I think you’re going to continue to see really blown-out perfect skin and foundations that provide more coverage with even lighter textures. Those are my predictions.

Originally written for Counter Intelligence Issue 02